I'm only really worried about the sounds ruining the experience. Realistic audio is just as important as the graphics, and if the sewing machine sound with less environmental reverb than an airsoft gun in the thompson video is anything to go by, it will be just sad... so much for immersive next gen experience.
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Realistic suggestions!
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VonMudra
Well-known member
All those sounds were effectively placeholders for animation videos. Our sounds are heavily WIP and we are doing our best to get high quality weaponry effects. For starters, there wasn't even any environmental reverb in ANY of those videos, and we actively stated that as such. So yeah, use those videos to see our awesome animations. Expect sounds videos later on. 
calgoblin
Pathfinder Games
Sound is the most important part of the game (sorry teammates).
But yeah, what Mudra said. Those weapon videos included heavily WIP everything. And as there was only the one gun firing in each, when everyone in the server is firing something different (along with other various ambiences) it will be marvellous.
(By the way we're not 'next-gen', we're Traction Wars-gen.)
But yeah, what Mudra said. Those weapon videos included heavily WIP everything. And as there was only the one gun firing in each, when everyone in the server is firing something different (along with other various ambiences) it will be marvellous.
(By the way we're not 'next-gen', we're Traction Wars-gen.)
Feldmeijer
Member
calgoblin
Pathfinder Games
That's cool, you can be my official sound consulting sloth. Must be more 'pew pew pew tuhuhuhuh booooooooof'
Boltaction
Member
Not sure if I have not read something of the stuff I´m going to write down now has been mentioned before, if so I´m sorry.
Supression:
Someone suggested Points as a reward for supression and although it seems to encourage Teamwork it might also give away the enemys Position, especially if you are using something like a mg, with ist high RoF.
As for effects of beeing supressed I could imagine something like a loud zing noise where the bullet flies past and a sway effect to the other direction. For example if the bullte goes past you on the left your gun would swing to the right a bit.
Medics:
I´m not sure if you posted your respawn System somewhere else before, but I havent seen it, so this might not work. But maybe the medic could set up a first aid Point somewhere ( like Rally Points in PR for example) and if he manages to carry a wounded Soldier to that Point he will get patched up there instead of respawning at the farer away spawn Point. ( though this is futile if spawn on squadleader is planed).
Additional:
I would love to see a giving up Option, I really hate the fact that in games you alway have to kill each and every enemy, while in RL Soldiers surrenderd quite often. Maybe you could implement a slow surrender Animation at whichs end one is spawned at the next Objective (maybe double the respawn time?) but does not loose Tickets. ( So it benefits both sides )
Greetings
Boltaction
Supression:
Someone suggested Points as a reward for supression and although it seems to encourage Teamwork it might also give away the enemys Position, especially if you are using something like a mg, with ist high RoF.
As for effects of beeing supressed I could imagine something like a loud zing noise where the bullet flies past and a sway effect to the other direction. For example if the bullte goes past you on the left your gun would swing to the right a bit.
Medics:
I´m not sure if you posted your respawn System somewhere else before, but I havent seen it, so this might not work. But maybe the medic could set up a first aid Point somewhere ( like Rally Points in PR for example) and if he manages to carry a wounded Soldier to that Point he will get patched up there instead of respawning at the farer away spawn Point. ( though this is futile if spawn on squadleader is planed).
Additional:
I would love to see a giving up Option, I really hate the fact that in games you alway have to kill each and every enemy, while in RL Soldiers surrenderd quite often. Maybe you could implement a slow surrender Animation at whichs end one is spawned at the next Objective (maybe double the respawn time?) but does not loose Tickets. ( So it benefits both sides )
Greetings
Boltaction
Platybelodon {TP}
Member
I too would like to see the option to surrender. Many's the time a decorated soldier was cited for assaulting an MG post, killing three and capturing ten. We seem to have got the idea that everyone fights to the death in our video games, when in the Western Desert the Allies found many Italians waiting with their suitcases packed!
That would also work well with the suggestion I made last page about having a 'humanity' point count. Shooting those who had surrendered would obviously have a negative impact!
Quite a lot of this stuff is about role-playing, which is why for me the control system in ArmA or Receiver is so satisfying. Gun control or something as simple as free-look, lowering a weapon, saluting or sitting down all massively increase the immersion. I can imagine myself surrendering if it was properly managed. Sometimes the spawning process is too easy, so a death doesn't feel as important as it should. This has something to do with the concept mentioned earlier in the thread about every soldier being interchangeable and reappearing in the squad as one does in RO2.
Having to deal with taking soldiers back to a command post (whether prisoners or wounded) would create interesting squad logistic issues as one or two members have to be detailed to do so and perhaps bring back extra supplies for the rest of the squad. What do people think about the feasibility of all these ideas? There have been many interesting thoughts in this thread on 'support' issues like medics and the 'non-shooting' parts!
That would also work well with the suggestion I made last page about having a 'humanity' point count. Shooting those who had surrendered would obviously have a negative impact!
Quite a lot of this stuff is about role-playing, which is why for me the control system in ArmA or Receiver is so satisfying. Gun control or something as simple as free-look, lowering a weapon, saluting or sitting down all massively increase the immersion. I can imagine myself surrendering if it was properly managed. Sometimes the spawning process is too easy, so a death doesn't feel as important as it should. This has something to do with the concept mentioned earlier in the thread about every soldier being interchangeable and reappearing in the squad as one does in RO2.
Having to deal with taking soldiers back to a command post (whether prisoners or wounded) would create interesting squad logistic issues as one or two members have to be detailed to do so and perhaps bring back extra supplies for the rest of the squad. What do people think about the feasibility of all these ideas? There have been many interesting thoughts in this thread on 'support' issues like medics and the 'non-shooting' parts!
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Boltaction
Member
Well, if you ask me , I don´t think that will be feasible. The reason for this is just the same you gave in your post yourself, escorting POW´s back to Camp is a roleplaying Thing, bit TW will be a tacticalshooter. Hence I don´t see why any attacking force would voluntary loose it´s momentum by going back to secure some POW. There would have to be some massive reward, but even then I don´t think it would fit the scale of a shooter. In regards to shooting surrenderd enemys I´m a bit worried myself, my first thinking would be to just make every POW invulnerable just like most games do with civillians and from a morale Point of view that would be fine. On the other Hand I can see that having some god-like, bulletproof German Walking towards you with his Hands above the Head might ruin the Immersion. But maybe someone else got a solution for this?
Greetings
Boltaction
Greetings
Boltaction
^ Well you could always make it a gamemode... Something like 1 respawn only, if you capture and escort a POW both of you get one extra (or the capturer gets one for his team and one for himself)? Surrendering would then be your only chance of continuing to play if you are let's say incapacitated to fight ... But it might be too hardcore for most people (and would require a pretty complicated wounding system) ...
Overall pretty hard to pull off decently, but if someone managed to do it would be something that has very rarely (if ever) been done before...
Would make for a pretty interesting metagame and some really cool decisions. Do I take this POW and risk getting killed, but earn a few respawns in the process? Or do I ignore him and press on, denying the enemy extra respawns, but at the same time denying them to my team too? And from the POW's point of view, do I surrender and secure myself another chance of playing, tying up the enemy forces in the process, but granting them more respawns, or do I die heroically and sit it out with the rest of the dead but deny the enemy extra respawns...
Overall pretty hard to pull off decently, but if someone managed to do it would be something that has very rarely (if ever) been done before...
Would make for a pretty interesting metagame and some really cool decisions. Do I take this POW and risk getting killed, but earn a few respawns in the process? Or do I ignore him and press on, denying the enemy extra respawns, but at the same time denying them to my team too? And from the POW's point of view, do I surrender and secure myself another chance of playing, tying up the enemy forces in the process, but granting them more respawns, or do I die heroically and sit it out with the rest of the dead but deny the enemy extra respawns...
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Platybelodon {TP}
Member
I think there's a lot of potential in the 'meta-game' that doesn't preclude the 'tactical shooter' aspect. The tactics of the support classes and dealing with the messiness of the battlefield rather than the simple kill-or-be-killed paradigm could be very powerful.
As I said earlier in the thread about how to make a 'boring' support class like a medic useful, there could be end-of-round bonuses for 'humanity' if a medic treated wounded enemy soldiers in the match, so there'd be a trade-off between enraged squad mates shooting dead those they've just wounded as they advance on a position (gaining kill points) and leaving them for the medic to possibly increase the team's score overall.
Role-playing is part of the charm - even in Red Orchestra the iron-sights animation or the option to add or remove bayonets could be construed as 'role-playing' and adds a lot. Crouching in a trench putting a bayonet on adds more to a game than just being able to run straight in as the gun comes with it attached. Even playing tactically is role-playing, as we don't want to play the Doom role of a one-man-band but desire an experience more like a member of a squad.
As I said earlier in the thread about how to make a 'boring' support class like a medic useful, there could be end-of-round bonuses for 'humanity' if a medic treated wounded enemy soldiers in the match, so there'd be a trade-off between enraged squad mates shooting dead those they've just wounded as they advance on a position (gaining kill points) and leaving them for the medic to possibly increase the team's score overall.
Role-playing is part of the charm - even in Red Orchestra the iron-sights animation or the option to add or remove bayonets could be construed as 'role-playing' and adds a lot. Crouching in a trench putting a bayonet on adds more to a game than just being able to run straight in as the gun comes with it attached. Even playing tactically is role-playing, as we don't want to play the Doom role of a one-man-band but desire an experience more like a member of a squad.
This one goes to the sound engineers
One of the biggest things that can make or break a game for me is audio. If the game looks great and plays great but it doesn't sound great... no go.
From what I've heard for now I suggest you beef up the audio of the guns if possible. Lots of us have pricey gaming equipment so it would be a shame if those 7.1 Systems with juicy bass would go to waste if the guns sounded like they were shooting BB pellets.
One of the biggest things that can make or break a game for me is audio. If the game looks great and plays great but it doesn't sound great... no go.
From what I've heard for now I suggest you beef up the audio of the guns if possible. Lots of us have pricey gaming equipment so it would be a shame if those 7.1 Systems with juicy bass would go to waste if the guns sounded like they were shooting BB pellets.
calgoblin
Pathfinder Games
This one goes to the sound engineers
Greetings!
All sound we've shown so far has been heavily WIP, not to mention the poop Youtube compression that goes on. Anyway your surround sounds and 'spensive gaming headsets won't be misused. (All games should be played in 5.1/7.1 IMO!) And it obviously depends on the guns; but there isn't as much bass in small gunfire as Hollywood would have you believe
Greetings!
All sound we've shown so far has been heavily WIP, not to mention the poop Youtube compression that goes on. Anyway your surround sounds and 'spensive gaming headsets won't be misused. (All games should be played in 5.1/7.1 IMO!) And it obviously depends on the guns; but there isn't as much bass in small gunfire as Hollywood would have you believe
Well aware of what's been said, sir. Can't wait to try the game out.
Thank you for your reply. That's dev's being involved with the community right here.
I hope supersonic bullet booms also receive some attention, in reality bullets passing by tens of meters away are still so loud it hurts the ears... not one game I've tried so far has modeled that correctly.Greetings!
All sound we've shown so far has been heavily WIP, not to mention the poop Youtube compression that goes on. Anyway your surround sounds and 'spensive gaming headsets won't be misused. (All games should be played in 5.1/7.1 IMO!) And it obviously depends on the guns; but there isn't as much bass in small gunfire as Hollywood would have you believe
Ideally you would be able to pinpoint an MG42 burst flying off to your side 50m away from you, as the stream of booms at 1200RPM would sound like volley of guns going off to your side (and shortly afterwards you would hear the actual gun firing from distance). This realistic audio would give a really good idea what is firing at you and from where.
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Well maybe sole bullets are not that bad, but from my experience the sonic booms get really loud when you're checking targets down range and suddenly 30+ guns open fire in the neighboring range. And those ranges were separated by massive dirt walls, still had to put back on hearing protection.
That is possible, the shooting range where i have my experience from is 10 lanes with rifle fire. so a shot every few seconds. It has a trench at the 75 meter mark where you can put target up on 2 meter high sticks. I have no idea how the sensation would be of 1000 shots a minute passing by.
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