Ideas (Communication, Mumble, Close Combat, Commander:, Other)

[FlyingR]

Communication:
Ok, I'm sure many have already pointed out (including myself) that there should be a kit or a person that should be a radio operator. There are 2 different ideas we could go from here.
1. This person would be the squad leader, besides having other tools like binoculars, colored smoke grenades and such, he would have also a radio. With this, he wouldn't have to rely on another member to transmit messages between squad leaders and commanders.

2. This might be the most realistic one, is that there would be a radio operator and the squad leader would have to tell everything to the RO so that he could send the message.

Regarding the Radio, if it happens to get shot, it could be damaged making the radio useless.

Mumble:
I believe that to make realistic as possible, it's that if you speak, anybody can hear you, including the enemy. This would avoid unnecessary teamchatter, it would make it easy for the squad leader and the RO to communicate efficiently with the other squad leaders and commander.

This could be set so that mumble only works for a certain radius, like up to 30 meters or something.
This would add a lot of intensity to the game so people would be really careful and sitting on the edge of the seat trying to listen for any sound.

Close Combat:
At the press of a button, or the change weapon number, you could switch to using your fists just like in Project Reality. There may be a kit that doesn't require a knife or due to something you are without a kit so you could rely on fists. As well you could use the stock of a weapon, or the whole weapon itself.

Commander:
Like BF2, there should be squads, and on top of that a commander (this person would be a veteran/high ranking officer).
Hey would have the ability of sending air attacks, artillery attacks, naval attacks, and air scouts (a plane could fly by an area) would reveal everything in the map to the Commander, and with that the Commander could tell the squads.

Other:
There should be a command, or the press of a button that could do actions like saluting, maybe do signs (throw grenade, count to 3, suppress, and stuff like that!) so that would be necessary for talking on mumble!

 

[Aniallator]

Ok, I'm sure many have already pointed out (including myself) that there should be a kit or a person that should be a radio operator. There are 2 different ideas we could go from here.
1. This person would be the squad leader, besides having other tools like binoculars, colored smoke grenades and such, he would have also a radio. With this, he wouldn't have to rely on another member to transmit messages between squad leaders and commanders.

2. This might be the most realistic one, is that there would be a radio operator and the squad leader would have to tell everything to the RO so that he could send the message.

I agree, radios are a must. IMO there ought to be two types of radios, backpack and static. Backpack radios are equipped by Radiomen (rather than NCOs), while a few static radios can be found around the maps, such as in bunkers and dugouts. To use backpack radios (when not a Radioman), you'd go up to a Radioman and press the use key. If you're not a Commander or an NCO, however, you'll need the Radioman's permission.

Regarding the Radio, if it happens to get shot, it could be damaged making the radio useless.

Agreed, were any radio to get shot anywhere, it'll be useless.

I believe that to make realistic as possible, it's that if you speak, anybody can hear you, including the enemy. This would avoid unnecessary teamchatter, it would make it easy for the squad leader and the RO to communicate efficiently with the other squad leaders and commander.

This could be set so that mumble only works for a certain radius, like up to 30 meters or something.
This would add a lot of intensity to the game so people would be really careful and sitting on the edge of the seat trying to listen for any sound.

Already in the game

At the press of a button, or the change weapon number, you could switch to using your fists just like in Project Reality. There may be a kit that doesn't require a knife or due to something you are without a kit so you could rely on fists. As well you could use the stock of a weapon, or the whole weapon itself.

Fists? I think it'd be better if there were a mêlée key, and pressing it would mêlée with whatever weapon you're holding (the bayonet or the butt of a rifle, the grip of a pistol, et cetera).

Like BF2, there should be squads, and on top of that a commander (this person would be a veteran/high ranking officer).
Hey would have the ability of sending air attacks, artillery attacks, naval attacks, and air scouts (a plane could fly by an area) would reveal everything in the map to the Commander, and with that the Commander could tell the squads.

Agreed. IMO Commanders ought to have aerial, artillery (or naval artillery on some maps), and mortar strikes available; however, what strikes are available should depend on the map for historical reasons. For example, on a Gold beach map, the British Commander can request aerial and naval artillery strikes while the German Commander can request artillery and mortar strikes. On Lebisey, the British Commander can request aerial, artillery, and mortar strikes while the German Commander can request the same. On Merville, the British Commander can request naval artillery strikes while the German Commander can request artillery and mortar strikes.

An aerial strike would be two planes (ground attack craft) that strafe and bomb the target, with a long cooldown time. An artillery and naval artillery strike would be a few salvoes of artillery shells on the target, with a moderate cooldown time. A mortar strike would be a few salvoes of mortar rounds on the target, with a short cooldown time. By mortars I mean heavy mortars, not like the light mortars you can carry in the game.

As a Commander or an NCO, you'd use your binocs to mark a target. If you're an NCO, you'd then have to use a radio to relay the coordinates. If you're a Commander, you can use a radio to set an available strike on the target, or any targets relayed by the NCOs.

There won't be spotting, so I'd say no to aerial reconnaissance.

There should be a command, or the press of a button that could do actions like saluting, maybe do signs (throw grenade, count to 3, suppress, and stuff like that!) so that would be necessary for talking on mumble!

You mean a commo rose? Perhaps a good idea for those that don't use VOIP... as long as there's good voice acting.

 

[SpaceCroissant]

I believe that to make realistic as possible, it's that if you speak, anybody can hear you, including the enemy. This would avoid unnecessary teamchatter, it would make it easy for the squad leader and the RO to communicate efficiently with the other squad leaders and commander.

This could be set so that mumble only works for a certain radius, like up to 30 meters or something.
This would add a lot of intensity to the game so people would be really careful and sitting on the edge of the seat trying to listen for any sound.

Already in the game

Hehe xD

 

[FlyingR]

Yes, static radios not only should they be implemented as backpack radios, and static radios (like you said bunkers, bases), but also like I've mentioned in another post, radios should appear in HQs that are spawned by squad leaders.

As for the fists, sure I don't mind, I was throwing that idea out hahaha.

I say that there should be spotting since there were many scouting sorties, so it would a realistic factor.

The Germans did have 2 FW-190 strafe and rocket Gold and/or Juno beaches, so think that the Germans could also have an air attack possibility.


Sure we could use a commo rose, but what I meant for hand signals is this:
Either by commo rose or using chat and typing "!salute" (like WWIIO?), "!1-0" (that would be the numbers), "!gr" (grenade), "!sm" (smoke), "!stop/halt", "!onme", "!321" (countdown), "!supr" (suppressing fire) etc.

Maybe you could type in phrases like "!321,gr" (so after the countdown throw grenades).

So by either pressing that on the commo rose or by typing on the chat, your person would do these animated actions.
Below it's an image of what I mean by tactical hand signs. So if you think an enemy is around, or you are ready to attack an enemy position, to avoid using mumble and the enemy hearing you, you could do the following or similar actions.

 

[Fliper]

Maybe this is to much .

 

[Aniallator]

I say that there should be spotting since there were many scouting sorties, so it would a realistic factor.

But there's nothing realistic about spotting; it's an arcadey feature that belongs in Battlefield, not a realism game.

The Germans did have 2 FW-190 strafe and rocket Gold and/or Juno beaches, so think that the Germans could also have an air attack possibility.

Indeed... but, as you stated, it's but two planes. Anyway, were the Germans allowed aerial strikes on a Gold beach map, they should only get one.

Mind you, I don't think we should have aerial strikes if planes are implemented at some stage.

Sure we could use a commo rose, but what I meant for hand signals is this:
Either by commo rose or using chat and typing "!salute" (like WWIIO?), "!1-0" (that would be the numbers), "!gr" (grenade), "!sm" (smoke), "!stop/halt", "!onme", "!321" (countdown), "!supr" (suppressing fire) etc.

Maybe you could type in phrases like "!321,gr" (so after the countdown throw grenades).

So by either pressing that on the commo rose or by typing on the chat, your person would do these animated actions.
Below it's an image of what I mean by tactical hand signs. So if you think an enemy is around, or you are ready to attack an enemy position, to avoid using mumble and the enemy hearing you, you could do the following or similar actions.

Ah, I see. Well, at Heer Hand Signals / der Erste Zug are some German hand signs. Perhaps non-Commanders and non-NCOs can use a few basic signs, while Commanders and NCOs can also use some more command-oriented ones?

 

[FlyingR]

But there's nothing realistic about spotting; it's an arcadey feature that belongs in Battlefield, not a realism game.

I think I explained badly, a lot of games have that, including Company of Heroes. The commander would initiate a scout sortie, for the this the commander would choose in the map where would the scout flyby. With this, the plane would would fly from the allied main base in a straight line to where the commander marked it go and come back. While the plane flies to the objective, the commander could see in the map every visible enemy unit in the plane's path.

Indeed... but, as you stated, it's but two planes. Anyway, were the Germans allowed aerial strikes on a Gold beach map, they should only get one.

Mind you, I don't think we should have aerial strikes if planes are implemented at some stage.

Let's say we start with the landings in D-Day, the Allied commander would be able to initiate naval and air strikes, whereas the Germans would have aerial and cannon strikes. They would either be number limited or as you said previously have a cool-down time (or both!).

Ah, I see. Well, at Heer Hand Signals / der Erste Zug are some German hand signs. Perhaps non-Commanders and non-NCOs can use a few basic signs, while Commanders and NCOs can also use some more command-oriented ones?

Hey man, that's a great find! Yeah I like that idea! But should it be done by Commo Rose, chat, or another method?

 

[Pjosip]

For radios, if their usage is only verbal communication it would be pretty useless.
Firstly it would be to complicated and obstructive for regular players (taking away from fun) and for clans they will simply use teamspeak or something anyway.

 

[Aniallator]

I think I explained badly, a lot of games have that, including Company of Heroes. The commander would initiate a scout sortie, for the this the commander would choose in the map where would the scout flyby. With this, the plane would would fly from the allied main base in a straight line to where the commander marked it go and come back. While the plane flies to the objective, the commander could see in the map every visible enemy unit in the plane's path.

I understand what you're saying, but spotting is just unrealistic, and so doesn't belong in a realism game.

Let's say we start with the landings in D-Day, the Allied commander would be able to initiate naval and air strikes, whereas the Germans would have aerial and cannon strikes. They would either be number limited or as you said previously have a cool-down time (or both!).

In the end, it all depends on what strikes'll be in the game. I mean, I'm sure we'll have artillery, but I can't be sure about mortars and planes. If we can pilot planes at a later stage in the game, I wouldn't want to have aerial strikes anyway.

Hey man, that's a great find! Yeah I like that idea! But should it be done by Commo Rose, chat, or another method?

Though it means more HUD (ugh), I think a commo rose would be best. Learning and memorizing key combos would be too hard.

And [MENTION=1505]Pjosip[/MENTION], I was thinking about radios in the sense that they'd be used for both radio-to-radio communication and calling in strikes. I agree in that if they were used purely for communication, they'd be a bit useless.

 

[FlyingR]

I understand what you're saying, but spotting is just unrealistic, and so doesn't belong in a realism game.

Well, they did have recon planes in during the Normandy campaign (Spits, P-47s, Typhoons, etc). Of course you wouldn't be able to use it everytime you wanted it. Only the commander would be able to see where the enemy troops would be and he would, through radio comm or marking it on the map allow everybody to see the enemies' position. Everybody within range would be able to hear the airplanes so either they would either hide or prepare to shoot the plane down. I think this would make everybody in both teams realize the importance of stealth and hiding as well as being very careful when deciding to launch an attack as well as both teams could get caught in surprises meaning that they have to learn how to act fast and put their **** together in split seconds.

In the end, it all depends on what strikes'll be in the game. I mean, I'm sure we'll have artillery, but I can't be sure about mortars and planes. If we can pilot planes at a later stage in the game, I wouldn't want to have aerial strikes anyway.

Yes, if we can pilot planes later, of course AI aerial strikes and recon would be removed.

Though it means more HUD (ugh), I think a commo rose would be best. Learning and memorizing key combos would be too hard.

That's true, it could be like if you're holding a grenade you press on the commo rose button, and only actions for the grenade would appear. Like a finger countdown, "fire in the hole", etc.

As for @Pjosip's comment, TS would indeed be a problem or unfair during the game...

 

[Aniallator]

Well, they did have recon planes in during the Normandy campaign (Spits, P-47s, Typhoons, etc). Of course you wouldn't be able to use it everytime you wanted it. Only the commander would be able to see where the enemy troops would be and he would, through radio comm or marking it on the map allow everybody to see the enemies' position. Everybody within range would be able to hear the airplanes so either they would either hide or prepare to shoot the plane down. I think this would make everybody in both teams realize the importance of stealth and hiding as well as being very careful when deciding to launch an attack as well as both teams could get caught in surprises meaning that they have to learn how to act fast and put their **** together in split seconds.

Some fair points, but nonetheless... I'm against having recon planes for realism reasons I also take back having mortars. IMO, the only thing NCOs should be capable of calling in is artillery and (if flyable planes won't be implemented) planes.

Yes, if we can pilot planes later, of course AI aerial strikes and recon would be removed.

Thanks for clearing that up Wouldn't want AI planes and player planes flying around together.

That's true, it could be like if you're holding a grenade you press on the commo rose button, and only actions for the grenade would appear. Like a finger countdown, "fire in the hole", etc.

In the end, however they'd be implemented, hand signs would be very cool

TS would indeed be a problem or unfair during the game...

I agree, though TS is usually just used by clans, and realism-oriented clans may prefer using positional VOIP and radios anyway.

 

[Esu21]

The TS problem just happened in a lot of games like DayZ,but the ign voice chat is a must do and I dont think clans who come to a realistic game want to go against realism...

 

[FlyingR]

I dont think clans who come to a realistic game want to go against realism...

Let's hope so!

 

[SneakersDK]

Yes, static radios not only should they be implemented as backpack radios, and static radios (like you said bunkers, bases), but also like I've mentioned in another post, radios should appear in HQs that are spawned by squad leaders.

As for the fists, sure I don't mind, I was throwing that idea out hahaha.

I say that there should be spotting since there were many scouting sorties, so it would a realistic factor.

The Germans did have 2 FW-190 strafe and rocket Gold and/or Juno beaches, so think that the Germans could also have an air attack possibility.


Sure we could use a commo rose, but what I meant for hand signals is this:
Either by commo rose or using chat and typing "!salute" (like WWIIO?), "!1-0" (that would be the numbers), "!gr" (grenade), "!sm" (smoke), "!stop/halt", "!onme", "!321" (countdown), "!supr" (suppressing fire) etc.

Maybe you could type in phrases like "!321,gr" (so after the countdown throw grenades).

So by either pressing that on the commo rose or by typing on the chat, your person would do these animated actions.
Below it's an image of what I mean by tactical hand signs. So if you think an enemy is around, or you are ready to attack an enemy position, to avoid using mumble and the enemy hearing you, you could do the following or similar actions.

I think its a good Idea. few problems with this.
1: A lot of Animation, And it have to be precise with difficult finger animation.
2: A lot of command/Sign Language to select.
3: A lot of Signs to read and understand, Then we need a School tutorial to learn and guess what signs means.

 

[FlyingR]

1. Yes I understand that there's a lot of animation and it would have to be precise and look relatively nice. I mean, I don't think it is that hard to make (please correct me if I'm wrong), rather that it would take a long time to probably do so.

2. I agree to that as well, that's why typing in a command chat or something, although it is quite annoying as well, but a commo rose could work. Just like in Project Reality, if you have your grenade out, you press a key and a commo rose would appear with various options such as Frag Out (or something like that) and it would do a motion with the hand to throw a grenade, then you do it again with a countdown. I mean, I'm sure there's a way of making it simpler... but it would be very cool, not to mention realistic, which is what this game is aiming for.

3. Yeah, I suppose you could have a school tutorial for that, but by using it a lot you will end up memorizing it. If you have played Tactical Battlefield (mod for Arma), or at least seem some videos of it, you will see that it is complex, many things to remember, and that many of them, when they talk, use military terms, codes, and such. It makes you be more in the game I guess while making the communication more efficient.

I'm sure if this was to be implemented, it would be done it a later chapter, but I would love to use this, especially if the enemy would be able to hear your mumble/proximity.

 

[Aniallator]

I think limit hand signs to just a few (come, enemy, stop, et cetera) for simplicity.

 

[Aniallator]

I want to relay a minor epiphany I had, and figured it'd be better to use this thread rather than open up a new one.

I've been thinking about chat. While it's needed to relay any mic issues you may have to your SL, it's an issue itself, because it'd be used by players to communicate when they're too far away to use positional VOIP. So, I was thinking, why not implement chat like positional VOIP? Like positional VOIP, anything you post in chat would only be seen by players, friendly and enemy, in an X meter radius. Thus, you can relay mic issues as you normally would, while not being able to abuse the VOIP system by using chat. Because chat is only needed for relaying mic issues, I don't think there should be a non-positional chat for SLs like there is a non-positional VOIP for SLs.

 

[FlyingR]

I want to relay a minor epiphany I had, and figured it'd be better to use this thread rather than open up a new one.

I've been thinking about chat. While it's needed to relay any mic issues you may have to your SL, it's an issue itself, because it'd be used by players to communicate when they're too far away to use positional VOIP. So, I was thinking, why not implement chat like positional VOIP? Like positional VOIP, anything you post in chat would only be seen by players, friendly and enemy, in an X meter radius. Thus, you can relay mic issues as you normally would, while not being able to abuse the VOIP system by using chat. Because chat is only needed for relaying mic issues, I don't think there should be a non-positional chat for SLs like there is a non-positional VOIP for SLs.

Great idea! That would be awesome! Proximity chat!
Although for chat I do insist that there should proximity chat, admin chat (to report spam, hacks, bad behavior, etc.), and just in case, all chat.

The reason of all chat it is because if there's no admin, the players can talk with each other to ban/kick a certain misbehaving player. I've had many times where there are no admins on the server and there is one ******* who is ****ing around and you do a player kick/ban but nobody understands what's going on or just keep playing, so it's good to alert to everybody that you want to start a vote kick/ban so everybody helps you to kick the player. Also all chat is good to decide a mapvote.

Allchat should of course have some limitations and an anti-spam system where you can't send for example more than 3 messages for a period of time or something like that.

 

[Aniallator]

Great idea! That would be awesome! Proximity chat!
Although for chat I do insist that there should proximity chat, admin chat (to report spam, hacks, bad behavior, etc.), and just in case, all chat.

The reason of all chat it is because if there's no admin, the players can talk with each other to ban/kick a certain misbehaving player. I've had many times where there are no admins on the server and there is one ******* who is ****ing around and you do a player kick/ban but nobody understands what's going on or just keep playing, so it's good to alert to everybody that you want to start a vote kick/ban so everybody helps you to kick the player. Also all chat is good to decide a mapvote.

Allchat should of course have some limitations and an anti-spam system where you can't send for example more than 3 messages for a period of time or something like that.

Rather than all chat, what about being able to explain why X player needs to be kicked in the kick module itself? For map voting, just have a map voting module pop up near the end of a round, so you can just click the next map you vote for. I agree about having admin chat, though I think only admins should be able to what you post there.

 

[FlyingR]

Rather than all chat, what about being able to explain why X player needs to be kicked in the kick module itself? For map voting, just have a map voting module pop up near the end of a round, so you can just click the next map you vote for. I agree about having admin chat, though I think only admins should be able to what you post there.

You would need allchat because you need to tell the people to help you kick someone or else they won´t do it. I´ve had many occasions when I´m struggling to kick someone because they are being noobs and there are no admins so I basically allchat ¨X player is teamkilling, press PGUP to kick him¨or something like that. There are many instances where allchat is needed, no matter how small or irrelevant the topic is. I think it should be required but with limitations.

Yes definitely admin chat would not be visible to the rest of players.